Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?


The old and reliable.

Rookie
Rookie

Posts: 13

Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 12:19 am

Post Tue Nov 26, 2019 6:57 pm

Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

Hello. ....So originally my 49 KB2 came with a Holly 847 Carb. I have rebuilt it, and it runs ''well enough''. I can't explain it, but I just don't like it. It has a very small constrictor in the power charge circuit, which constantly plugs with even the smallest piece of debris. I have set the float high and low, and it still insists on dying if I turn very hard, or brake suddenly. I have two micro-screens inline.. one in an electric pump near the tank ( pushing fuel = less vapor lock ) and another in the stock fuel pump on top of the sediment bulb. I took to adding a second sediment bulb (with a new unused stone in it) right off the carb itself...it provides a great visual to what the gas is doing, and any contaminants. Still, it seems such a picky little thing....it just seems ''weak''.. I have a very nice Carter BBR1 waiting in the wings...should I try it?....any opinions on which is better?

As usual, I have to defer to my old Model A, which I have had for over 30 years...When I first got it, an old timer told me to throw out the zenith and use a Tillotson instead. He was right.. I haven't touched the carb. since. It doesn't care about alcohol, water, old gas or dirt..my sediment bulb is 1/4 full and it still runs great.. (Although the main jet is the size of a pencil..)

Maybe I need professional (mental) help...!!

Thanks, and take care! Mike
User avatar

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 655

Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:44 pm

Post Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:52 am

Re: Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

Please don't take this as me being a smart A$$, but I would start with making sure the gas tank and all lines are clean and transfer clean fuel to whatever carb you choose to use. Only then will you be able to compare and not have issues with contamination.
Good luck with it!
User avatar

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 107

Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:10 pm

Location: Eldon, Missouri USA

Post Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:23 pm

Re: Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

Mike - neither carb should plug with debris if your filters are working.

Having said that, will attempt an answer to your question. It actually depends on your use/expectations of the truck. If it is a numbers matching vehicle for shows, then the Holley 847 is superior to the Carter BBR.

If it is a truck you use, I wouldn't use either of them! ;)

Beginning in 1933 Carter always had a "price leader" single barrel. From 1933 to the early 1950's, it was the BBR. Of all of the carburetors Carter ever built, the BBR was the ONLY one Carter felt needed a troubleshooting chart!

http://www.thecarburetorshop.com/Service_Carter_BB_downdraft_issues.pdf

In 1949, Carter offered three grades of single barrel carburetors: cheap (BBR), mid-range quality and cost (W-1), and best (WA-1). Carter released a universal WA-1, part number 413s as a replacement for the 1949 KB BBR-1.

If I were to issue a numeric "quality" from 1 (awful) to 10 (wonderful), the 1949 version of the BBR would be a 5.5 (D-), the Holley 847 would be a 7 (C), and the WA-1 would be a 9 (A). Carter felt the same way about the BBR. There is a long, funny story about the 1947 Plymouth BBR-1; if you want to hear the story, give me a call. You might find it online, as I have typed it on a number of forums.

Original applications of the WA-1 (different part numbers) included Pontiac, Oldmobile, and Packard.

EDIT: and in the FWIW category: the Ford model A Zenith detests dirt; but if you maintain clean fuel, it will certainly outperform the Tillotson. I personally do not judge a carburetor by how it handles dirt (unless it is military). The biggest issue with the Ford model A Zenith is the cross-passage feeding the comp jet. On a vehicle that sits for a few years, it will probably become clogged with dirt/rust. In any event, any time a Ford A Zenith is rebuilt, the access plug to this passage SHOULD be removed, and the passage rodded out. Failure of a mechanic/rebuilder to do this simple procedure will cause the carb not to function as designed. On a driven vehicle, should not be an issue (if the fuel is clean).

Jon.
Good carburetion is fuelish hot air!

If you truly believe one size fits all, try walking a mile in your spouse's shoes!

Owner, The Carburetor Shop in Missouri
User avatar

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 107

Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:10 pm

Location: Eldon, Missouri USA

Post Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:42 pm

Re: Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

Considering your current issues:

While it is true that a carburetor out of adjustment can cause stalling on hard turns, it is often ignition (possibly a wire pulling).

Stalling when braking hard is generally caused by setting the idle too rich. If 100 percent of the idle mixture is supplied by the idle circuit, then the throttle plate will close completely under hard braking, thus causing the engine to stall. Turn the idle mixture control screw in to lean the mixture, then turn the throttle positioner screw out in to provide more volume of the mixture PLUS some air. This adjustment may help both of your issues.

Jon.
Good carburetion is fuelish hot air!

If you truly believe one size fits all, try walking a mile in your spouse's shoes!

Owner, The Carburetor Shop in Missouri

Rookie
Rookie

Posts: 13

Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 12:19 am

Post Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:49 pm

Re: Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

manifold ad.jpg
Thank you, thank you, thank you!!...I have only had this truck for four years, and if you say to use the Carter WA-1, than that is what I will do. She is a daily driver in summer, because I love to watch everyone's head swivel off as she (slowly) goes by. Why do you feel the WA-1 is slightly better than the Holly? Except for the hidden 3.54 gear-set, she is all original.
I did have the gas tank re-nued, and scrubbed out the filler neck with a stiff brush while I was at it...and I replaced 2/3 of the gas line ...I could hide a paper filter somewhere I suppose...
...but again, the Holly just seems ''weak''..

Also, I have a Nicson dual manifold off a bigger KB-6 or whatever- it -was..did they ever make a dual intake for the 214? ..seems someone would have made an aftermarket something. ..The claim was a 20% increase in fuel and travel efficiency, as you didn't have to always downshift going uphill...has anyone ever tried a dual on the 214?
User avatar

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 107

Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:10 pm

Location: Eldon, Missouri USA

Post Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:15 pm

Re: Holly 847 or Carter BBR1 Carb?

Don't rush right out and buy the first 413s you find. Buying on impulse costs extra money ;)

Try readjusting the idle as I suggested, and make sure the ignition is perfectly tuned. Then, if you wish, stay on the lookout for the 413s.

I have no information of the Ellis manifolds; just remember, it IS a 214.

Jon.
Good carburetion is fuelish hot air!

If you truly believe one size fits all, try walking a mile in your spouse's shoes!

Owner, The Carburetor Shop in Missouri

Return to K and KB

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by ST Software for PTF.