12 volt


IHC in the early to mid-fifties.

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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:20 pm

12 volt

I look for this topic already but could find what I needed. So today after having the truck for 2 years have found out that the reason my 12v batteries keep dying is because the guy that had it before me messed up and put a 12v battery in it. It is still wired for a 6v system. So what are my options now. I have bought all new tail and head lights for a 12v system. I plan on putting in a new wiring harness when I get done with the body work.

What is needed to switch it to a 12v system? Or is it better to keep it 6v, and if so will my new tail and head light still work with it?

Is there any drawbacks of a 6v system?

As always thanks for the help...and I know others have said it before, but I hate previous owners. :bashhead:

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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:51 pm

Re: 12 volt

cdorr0 wrote:I look for this topic already but could find what I needed. So today after having the truck for 2 years have found out that the reason my 12v batteries keep dying is because the guy that had it before me messed up and put a 12v battery in it. It is still wired for a 6v system. So is the battery Positive ground? So what are my options now. I have bought all new tail and head lights for a 12v system. I plan on putting in a new wiring harness when I get done with the body work. What are the condition of your gauges? Have they had "reducers" put in front of them? Do they work correctly on the 12volt battery? if so, then probably been "fixed" with reducers?
What is needed to switch it to a 12v system? Or is it better to keep it 6v, and if so will my new tail and head light still work with it?What do you want? If you are changing all the wiring harness, For me I would go ahead and finish the conversion. If lights/gauges are already done and you rewire, I think the main thing is the Generator/regulator combo to either a 12volt gen/reg combo or go with an alternator. Starter shoou uld work on the 12 volt(just do not grind it) The 12 volt system has the advantage of...... The original 6 volt set up with PROPER GROUNDS works just fine. If you want lots of gadgets in the cab(radios, amps etc. you might consider the change to 12volt.

Is there any drawbacks of a 6v system?My opinion, not really, IF you do not want a bunch of gadgets in the cab. You can get a 6 to 12 stepup to run them
As always thanks for the help...and I know others have said it before, but I hate previous owners. :bashhead:

These are my opinions only

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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:10 pm

Re: 12 volt

cdorr0 wrote:
I look for this topic already but could find what I needed. So today after having the truck for 2 years have found out that the reason my 12v batteries keep dying is because the guy that had it before me messed up and put a 12v battery in it. It is still wired for a 6v system. So is the battery Positive ground? The battery is - ground So what are my options now. I have bought all new tail and head lights for a 12v system. I plan on putting in a new wiring harness when I get done with the body work. What are the condition of your gauges? Have they had "reducers" put in front of them? Do they work correctly on the 12volt battery? if so, then probably been "fixed" with reducers? They were working when I had the 12v battery in there. the real problem was that the battery would not keep a charge.
What is needed to switch it to a 12v system? Or is it better to keep it 6v, and if so will my new tail and head light still work with it?What do you want? If you are changing all the wiring harness, For me I would go ahead and finish the conversion. If lights/gauges are already done and you rewire, I think the main thing is the Generator/regulator combo to either a 12volt gen/reg combo or go with an alternator. Starter shoou uld work on the 12 volt(just do not grind it) The 12 volt system has the advantage of...... The original 6 volt set up with PROPER GROUNDS works just fine. If you want lots of gadgets in the cab(radios, amps etc. you might consider the change to 12volt.I would like to put a radio, and maybe a cell phone charging plug but thats about it. is there a specific alternator I should go with? and do I need all new gauges?

Is there any drawbacks of a 6v system?My opinion, not really, IF you do not want a bunch of gadgets in the cab. You can get a 6 to 12 stepup to run them

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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:35 pm

Re: 12 volt

You will need to either change to the 12volt generator and Regulator. Here is a good read on Generators: http://oldihc.wordpress.com/category/fr ... lectrical/
If you do stay with 12volt you should make sure that there are something like a Runtz in line with the gauges. Others can tell you more about those. You can change out your gauges for newer gauges, however you also need to change out the senders at the same time for ones that match the new gauges.
for running the small items you are talking about from a 6 volt set up, you will need to acquire a step up transformer from 6 volt positive ground to 12volt negative ground. I know they are out there.
An alternator, which one to use, That I am not so sure of.

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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 8:44 pm

Re: 12 volt

The positive ground systems were popular fifty or more years ago because someone with a government grant was studying which direction the electrons flow in a conductor. Rather than change what was proclaimed to be obvious, to the early nerds, many manufacturers just "went with the flow", so to speak.
Here is the thing, this is 2013 and the old positive ground thing is mostly unknown to all but a very few persons. Cornbinder 89 might be the best expert on these old systems and mystery gauges that were popular, back in the day. If I were going to be concerned about anything to do with this obsolete positive ground system and 6 volts, it would be for safety sake.
Here is something to think about. You have decided to use the old negative ground system and your truck will need assistance to get it started. The Auto Club person shows up and common sense tells him to put the positive cable clamp to positive battery post and the negative clamp onto the engine somewhere away from the battery to avoid igniting the off-gassing from the battery. It is very likely that the battery will explode from the reverse polarity and the voltage differential. It is more than likely that any gauges that are on will be destroyed along with the senders. If you go away in your six volt truck and a light burns out, where will you get a replacement? Who will fix your generator or regulator? Almost all of the older mechanics from my generation have or are bout to retire and the "new guys are not being trained for the old systems, and why should they, it is obsolete and uncommon.
Forget about using an generator in a 12 volt conversion especially if you are considering putting any modern electronics into your Binder. Generators in combination with the regulator cause large voltage spikes that will certainly destroy anything with a transistor in it. The coils in the regulator act like capacitors and discharge a lot of volts when the points cycle.
Delco have made hundreds of millions of alternators for their own vehicles and their very reliable alternator can be seen in some exotic cars and it was the first choice of IHC when the finally got smart. There are so many of then in the auto recyclers that they often send them out as scrap. Even the earliest 55 amp Delco alternators are better than the best generator. Always look for an alternator that is internally regulated and I would not advise anyone to use a single wire unit. Rather than waste space here, Google how an alternator works. It is genius. There is some good information on the single wire units. BTW, an alternator is too easy to mount
A mixed system of voltage drops and resistance inline to try and cooers 12 volts to do something else is not good in any way. If a person is starting from basics with a restoration, it is best to start with a new wire kit. While I cannot name them all, here are some that I am familiar with. Ron Francis, Painless Performance, American Autowire, Hot-rod wire and Speedway Motors. Google what you are looking for and make a decision. I would doubt that one is better than another, but I prefer the Ron Francis system even though it is more money. RF has some innovative fusing and other good ideas.
All of these kits are so easy to use. Each wire is labelled with its intended use and the direction it should go. Take it one wire at a time and you will not become overwhelmed. All of these wire kit suppliers have tech guys available to help sort out your situations. They have heard it all and are a super resource that you, the purchaser should use, without guilt. A trip to the corner store is one step at a time.
First question is often: What about my 6 volt starter? Ohm's law says that when the volts are raised by double the amps that are required to make the starter operate go down by half. An overbuilt 6 volt starter will thank you for 12 volts and run for many happy years, unless it is near the end of its service life, but then it would have gone poof, anyway. It is the amps that make thing heat up. Amps are the torque and volts are the horsepower, so to speak. To apply this to a garden hose, the amps are the pressure, the volts are the volume in litres per unit of time.
Last edited by nikkinutshop on Sat Oct 12, 2013 8:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 9:04 pm

Re: 12 volt

Here is a little and fun project. Take one of those old fan motors that everyone has sitting around and couple it to an alternator from the auto recycler. Following some simple wiring you will have a very good battery charger. Put one onto your lawnmower or rototiller and have a portable battery charger. My hunter neighbour has an alternator adapter for his chainsaw and he can charge a battery when he out there away from service. There are alternator kits available to make 120 volts for your appliances. Fire up the chainsaw, I want some toast, with that.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have
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Post Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:08 pm

Re: 12 volt

Thanks, I knew that Others would have good info. I find that the quickest way for more and better information than I give is to speak up. Never offended when someone corrects what I say.

Thanks all for passing on good info and sage advice!

Lloyd
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Post Sat Oct 12, 2013 2:51 am

Re: 12 volt

Battery charger?

A few years back, a buddy of mine took an old push lawn mower, removed the blade spindle, and attached a pulley...then made a mounting bracket and attached an alternator, and connected the pulleys with a belt. He added a battery from a riding mower to excite the alternator, and he had THE most portable battery charger I'd ever seen.

It may have been the ugliest as well...but it worked.
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Post Sat Oct 12, 2013 9:52 am

Re: 12 volt

I like the Rebel wire harnesses. Reasonably priced, easy to understand and the only one I'm aware of that uses XSL high temp insulation.

http://www.rebelwire.com/

Mad Electrical is a good site with a ton of info on car wiring, including some great advice on converting to a Delco 10 or 12si alternator. Mark Hamilton is a great guy with loads of knowledge about auto wiring, but if you call him (he only takes orders by phone for his pamphlets and wiring kits) make sure you have a spare hour or two- the man loves to talk! And you will learn a LOT.

http://www.madelectrical.com/electrical-tech.shtml
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Post Sat Oct 12, 2013 12:03 pm

Re: 12 volt

High temperature wire is definitely used by Painless, American Autowire And and Ron Francis. If a person is installing a complete wire harness an alternator is planned for in the design. There is nothing more to know other than adapting the alternator to the mount on the block. These kits have the alternator
wiring included. A person only needs special information for an adapting situation. The kits I mentioned are complete, new and none of the original junk is used.
Consider this, the original system has one very old breaker on the back of the light switch. If it sticks, you have a meltdown and fire. Once the smoke is out of the wires, you can't put it back in. just like a fart, once it is out........ it's over and you cannot put it back in ever again. .(from MAGIHC)
The original gauges are becoming increasingly expensive as the supply dwindles to zero. I does not make any sense to me to use an original replacement gauge that is as old as the one that failed. It is not possible to make a King Seeley gauge work on 12 volts. There are stories of , "Yah, it worked for me" but for how long? Before I knew better because I did not understand the KS system, I ran the original gauges on 12 volts and they lasted for a few days of erratic service then the smoke came out. The cost of modern quad gauges from companies like AUTOMETER and STEWART WARNER and more than a few others rival the pricing of increasingly rare OEM gauges. These quad gauge sets are a direct fit and depending on the style one choses, the gauges can look so much like the originals. I am an AUTOMETER person. These gauges work first time every time and are so reliable.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have
Artificial intelligence is no match for real stupidity....
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