Spicer PTO help


IHC in the early to mid-fifties.

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Post Fri Jul 31, 2020 1:07 am

Spicer PTO help

My transmission seems to be leaking an excessive amount of oil. It looks to me as if the leak is coming from the Spicer PTO, not from the gasket between the PTO and the transmission case or the PTO output shaft but from the shaft which engages/disengages the PTO. I am thinking the PTO needs to be rebuilt. Any thoughts? Where can I find parts?
My truck is a 1955 R162. It came with a New Process transmission, I think a 540. The PTO has "Spicer" inside a rhombus cast into the top and the bottom of the PTO case. I haven't located any model numbers on the PTO so far. I understand that the number may be on the inside of the case; I haven't pulled it off yet to look. I run 50 weight oil in the transmission as I have seen recommended elsewhere on the forum.

Golden Jubilee
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Post Fri Jul 31, 2020 7:04 am

Re: Spicer PTO help

The gasket or stack of gaskets between the trans and the PTO case set the backlash of the drive gears. This is very important, so if you remove, save the gasket stack and measure it so you can replicate it going back on. Too thin a gasket stack will burn the unit up in short order, too thick and the amount of tooth contact will be too little.
I'd just pull it off and measure the shaft and bore for a seal. SKF and others have a seal finder app where you enter the bore, shaft and thickness and it will give you the seal options.
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:23 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

I agree, most likely just the output shaft seal, unless you can push/pull the shaft side to side and see visible movement. That's seldom the case.

Dean
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:02 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

50wt. is too light, should be 90wt. or a multi like 80-140
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:37 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

SAE 50 engine oil is exactly the same viscosity and 90 gear lube, it is plenty fine for use in transmissions. Has better heat resistance (less like to oxidize) and is the preferred oil.

Golden Jubilee
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Post Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:55 am

Re: Spicer PTO help

The engagement shaft you are talking about uses a small specialized seal similar to what is used on shift shafts of four wheel drive transfer cases. When I rebuilt a NP 205 T-case I had it apart and that made it much easier to drive out the old seals and install the new ones. Depending on the OD and ID you may find the seal is the same size as the seals used in Spicer and New process transfer cases, this may help you if you find the seal hard to source.
56 S120 4x4,
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:19 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

cornbinder89 wrote:SAE 50 engine oil is exactly the same viscosity and 90 gear lube, it is plenty fine for use in transmissions. Has better heat resistance (less like to oxidize) and is the preferred oil.


learned something new, seems 90wt. would be too thick for a motor
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

Gear oil vs. engine oil viscosity

75 Gl= 30 engine oil
80 GL= 40 engine oil
90 GL= 50 engine oil
140 GL= 60 engine oil

The viscosity remain in that correlation at 100 deg C as well as at 0 deg C
Somewhere on some computer I have a side by side comparison chart.
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Golden Jubilee
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Post Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:31 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

Lifelong Kansan
Grew up with red paint
Moved off the farm 33 years ago.

Golden Jubilee
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Post Mon Aug 03, 2020 1:39 pm

Re: Spicer PTO help

Humm, that differs widely from the chart I had. On the high end it was similar but is way different on the low end. It also differs greatly from oil recommendations I've seen where both gear lube and engine oil are listed in the spec's
For example Saab list 75 GL or SAE 30 engine oil for their transaxle. The Saab spec's match the chart I saw, I'll have to look for it. In that chart 75 GL is more equal to 20 engine oil?
I wonder if it has to do with "flow enhancers" in engine oil IE the "W" rating?
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