How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?


Forum designed for the D series and older

User avatar

Site Admin
Site Admin

Posts: 122

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:23 pm

Location: Verona, WI

Post Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:16 am

How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

Ok experts, how can you tell the difference between the HD 213 and the GRD 213? I am supposed to have a HD 213 in my '39 D-2, but some of the numbers aren't matching up to the parts catalog.

The number stamped in top of the head, right in front of the thermostat housing is 1760 YE, and the number on the top, drivers side rear of the block is 61963 HH.

I know for all intents and purposes they are the same engine, but once in a while the parts manual differentiates between the two so it would be nice to confirm.

Thanks,

John

"Cornelius" - The "Rolling Restoration" of a 1939 IHC D-2 Pickup - 113" WB
New Website - "Restoring Cornelius"

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 2028

Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:52 pm

Post Mon Aug 21, 2017 3:22 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

Green Diamond has cast into it "Green Diamond" with the tri-diamond symbol. GRD is part of the engine serial number.
HD has HD as part of the engine serial. Sometimes HD only has partial cooling jackets.
I've been told the two are not interchangeable parts-wise. Yet, gaskets, pumps, distributors, heads all interchange. AND with Willys, too. It's a Willys engine.
GRD fits where HD was except for engine pulley. GRD pulley can be much larger.
User avatar

Site Admin
Site Admin

Posts: 122

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:23 pm

Location: Verona, WI

Post Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:46 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

All great info, thanks. It's for certain that if the green diamond logo is cast on the block that it is a green diamond engine and not an HD? I thought I saw somewhere (and I'm not saying my memory is right on this...) that an individual stated he had an HD with the green diamond logo on it, which admittedly does NOT make sense as the HD is a Willys mill.

"Cornelius" - The "Rolling Restoration" of a 1939 IHC D-2 Pickup - 113" WB
New Website - "Restoring Cornelius"

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 2028

Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:52 pm

Post Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:48 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

IHC was NOT much into flatheads and light duty stuff until the 1933 (Willys) D-1. The reason why D Series starts with D-2. IHC paid Willys to build their engines under license? The D-1 was "badge engineered".
I've never heard of a GRD/ HD hybrid from the factory, but we are finding out stuff all the time. There are late D Series with K Series pickup beds, etc. I have one.
IHC liked to use up what they had before installing the newer style part? Sure seems like it. Or introducing a different style part outside of model change?
For most of us, HD ended with 1940 D Series LIGHT DUTY, GRD started with 1941 K Series LIGHT DUTY.

Freshly Restored
Freshly Restored

Posts: 215

Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:44 pm

Location: Mendon, MA

Post Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:49 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

I could be wrong but I always thought the GRD used bolts to bolt down the head to the block where the HD used studs and nuts.

--George
37 D2 Pickup - restored
76 Scout II Terra - restored
74 International 200 4x4 - restoring
2011 F350

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 108

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:30 pm

Location: Tacoma, WA

Post Tue Aug 22, 2017 1:03 am

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

A GRD engine can show up in a late 30's D-2 if someone swapped in a newer engine of course, mating to the old D-2 style bell housing. I have that in my 37 D-2 and have also seen another '38 with a GRD-214 retrofitted.
I consider my GRD-233 to be a "Frankenengine" - it has an HD engine head (same # as the original poster), a GRD block, an HD style distributor, and a K series 6 volt generator. It's also stamped and tagged with International Harvester rebuild info, and a "CAL" stamp - maybe rebuilt at a California facility. And maybe messed with by some devious soul! I assume a GRD head would be more efficient but right now it is what it is.
Now another useful source of info is in the Wisconsin Hist. Soc. McCormick collection. Can't locate it right now unfortunately. There is a brief article in one of IHCs monthly dealer magazines from around 1940 which describes the new GRD engine and lists many improvements over the HD design. I will try and find it. Sometimes they reached hard on what was considered an improvement.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 946

Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:28 am

Post Tue Aug 22, 2017 6:55 am

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

I was talking to a long time IHC owner in the midwest last winter who had a 1936 C-1 for sale in Vintage Truck. It had a Green diamond engine in it and when I told him it must be a replacement engine, he took strong exception and told me it was correct- something to the effect that both the GD and the HD were being used at the same time for a while. He convinced me that he was probably correct since he seemed to know a lot about the subject. Stickman 207

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 108

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:30 pm

Location: Tacoma, WA

Post Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:46 am

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

Found the IHC Trail magazine article about the Green Diamond engine I mentioned in an earlier post. The International Trail: Volume 17, number 6, November 1940, pages 8-9 and 19. New for 1940.
http://content.wisconsinhistory.org/cdm/compoundobject/collection/ihc/id/28937/rec/113

edited to correct page number citation

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 2028

Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:52 pm

Post Tue Aug 22, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

Stickman, that C-1 (and my C-30) had their engines replaced.
People (me, too) are nuts!
User avatar

Site Admin
Site Admin

Posts: 122

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:23 pm

Location: Verona, WI

Post Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:57 pm

Re: How to Tell HD213 from Green Diamond?

Lively discussion - love it!

Well, if the Green Diamond logo is only found on the GRD engine, that is apparently what I have. Looks like I'll need more manuals... Oh well.

John

"Cornelius" - The "Rolling Restoration" of a 1939 IHC D-2 Pickup - 113" WB
New Website - "Restoring Cornelius"
Next

Return to 1940 and Older

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by ST Software for PTF.