Remote Oil line routing


Forum designed for the D series and older

Freshly Restored
Freshly Restored

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Post Tue Jul 02, 2019 2:30 pm

Remote Oil line routing

I searched the forum and my Motor's Manual and came up empty. My motor had no filter. I found one that I'd like to use. The motor is the flathead without the water jackets around the cylinders on the left side (1936 C-30). I'm not going to guess as to what to actually call it, seemingly it has a couple of different monikers. There is an oil pressure relief nut and adjustment screw on the left side of the block. It has a 1/4" pipe plug at the 12 o'clock position above it a couple of inches and one a the 6 o'clock position below. I'm sure one is pressurized and the other is not. I'd like to not get it wrong. I do know that the top fitting on the filter is the outlet (i cheated, it's marked) and the bottom is the inlet. Thank you in advance.

Also, are there any reproduction filter stickers available that would be close to correct. I'm not a complete purist (since motor didn't have a filter originally) but I'd like to stay in theme. Thanks again

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

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Post Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:03 pm

Re: Remote Oil line routing

Blind squirrel
One way to tell if one of the fittings near the pressure relief valve dumps to the crankcase is to remove it and attach a fitting with a length of hose. Remove the dipstick as well. Blow in to the hose and if you hear the rushing air from the dipstick tube you know that port drains to the crankcase, and this should happen without any backpressure.

My guess for a source of pressurized oil for the filter would be to put a t fitting in where the oil pressure sender screws in to the block. Every D-2 bypass oil filter installation I’ve seen uses eighth inch diameter steel tubing to feed the filter. Others who know this engine will have a better idea.

Your engine is probably an HD-3. This will be stamped on the side of the engine block with serial number far forward drivers side just below the mating line with the cylinder head.

For filter decals I was going to recommend Jim Osborne Reproductions but their website is dead or down. You can find decals on EBay – example search for Deluxe Oil Filter decals, etc. Do you know the brand of filter housing? If it’s a DeLuxe it is stamped in to the top cover, may need to remove paint to see that,

Tom

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Post Wed Jul 03, 2019 5:36 am

Re: Remote Oil line routing

Thanks for the info Tom. Yes, it is the HD-3. The sad news is. Neither external filter canister that I have will work with this particular motor. The two bolt holes that are provided in the block for mounting, place the filter canister to close to the starter. Oh well, as usual back to the drawing board. Had this thing just about buttoned up and noticed a crack in the head through the thermostat area. Lucky I had a spare. Had to tear it down and track forward again. Glad I built a run stand. Would have been twice as hard wrestling the head on and off again if already in the frame. But finished the starter field coils re-wraps and got the rest of it all rebuilt and back together. Getting close.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Wed Jul 03, 2019 9:55 am

Re: Remote Oil line routing

How 'bout building a "stand Off" to hold the filter out from the bock a bit?

Pile of Parts
Pile of Parts

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Post Wed Jul 03, 2019 9:51 pm

Re: Remote Oil line routing

I have often questioned how effective a bypass oil filter really is. Any ideas?
I have a HD-3 in my C-30 and decided not to bother with an oil filter. I did fit a magnet to the oil drain plug and always change the oil every year or if I drive it on a trip, every 1000 miles.
The only mod I have done to the oil system is fit an electric prelube pump to the engine, so before I crank the engine the oil pressure is already 40psi. The pump is mounted inside the frame rail under the cab.

Freshly Restored
Freshly Restored

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Post Thu Jul 04, 2019 2:35 am

Re: Remote Oil line routing

Considering the claim is that the majority of engine wear is inflicted at start-up. I'd have no reservations in agreeing with you. With the changing of oil every 1000 miles you would be very hard pressed to have anything but a minuscule amount of contaminates ever present in your oil. I would be very interested in a description of your pre-start setup. I have ideas but why reinvent the wheel. I actually run a moroso pre-start system on a SBC I have in a 57 wagon. It's nothing more that a pressurized tank that you throw a manual valve open before start up. Then close the manual valve after oil pressure is reached through re-pressurization by the oil pump.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Thu Jul 04, 2019 12:57 pm

Re: Remote Oil line routing

Ever pulled a bearing cap after an engine has been sitting 15 years? I have and there is still oil on the crank and bearings.
Cyl walls are the places that are most likely to "dry out" and pre pressurizing doesn't necessarly get oil up there.
No harm in doing it, but I don't loose sleep over not doing it.
When these engines were built, oil of the day didn't hold dirt in suspension like modern oil, so it sank to the sump, by pass oil filters remove small particles circulating with the oil.
If you want the best for your old engine, you need both full flow and bypass filtration like modern heavy engines use. You'll have to re plumb the oiling to achieve that ends and it will not be stock.
Clean the sump every few years and use a bypass filter if it makes you feel good, but it still will likely outlast you unless you are diving you old truck 20K a year.
Only place I'd use pre-oiling is in emergency generator service at a hospital, where the engine needs to start and go to operating speed without spending any time a low speed. These often are heated and pressurized 24/7 with electric heaters and oil pumps.

Pile of Parts
Pile of Parts

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Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Post Fri Jul 05, 2019 10:19 pm

Re: Remote Oil line routing

My truck is 6 volt, but I have a 12 volt battery under the running board skirt. A spring return switch is mounted next to the wiper motor and the pump is mounted inside the frame rail under the floor.
Oil pickup from the side of the sump and discharge into the oil gallery. The pump will prime the system and when the oil pressure gauge reads oil pressure I hit the start button.

Here are a few pictures.
IMG_20190706_122827-1488x837.jpg

IMG_20190706_122857-1488x837.jpg

IMG_20190706_123005-1488x837.jpg

IMG_20190706_123013-1488x837.jpg

Freshly Restored
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Post Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:03 am

Re: Remote Oil line routing

You guys are so smart. My brother had bought a 36 C-1 (man is she in rough shape) that he had put in semi storage. I hadn't even considered looking under the hood until today. Low and behold the exact oil filter I have that I wanted to use hanging off the block. Yup, a stand off plate bolted under two head bolts. Pretty sure I can duplicate an exact copy and be in business. On a side note. I spotted a very weird difference in the two motors even though they are the same style HD motors. The size of the core plugs are way different. I wonder what other surprises a wait me? Hence the reason I said semi storage. It seems he gave it to me as a gift. Yay me, project number???? Oh heck with it, I lost count.

tmilob - thanks for the posting

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Post Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:04 pm

Re: Remote Oil line routing

Finally finished the last of the connections of the old girl to the engine run stand. Ran through a last minute double check of everything then hit the start button. Everything seemed fine. But while cranking, I wasn't showing any oil pressure build. So I stopped everything (turns out prematurely). I pulled the two plugs above and below the pressure relief port and found no sign of residual oil pressure. What I wanted to do before the first attempt was like I do in my more modern builds. Run a shaft down the distributor hole on a drill and drive the oil pump until oil pressure is built up. Then install the distributor and go for the fire up. Well you can't. At least not with the HD version of these motors. The oil pump is driven by a gear cast in the middle of the camshaft and a gear directly pinned on the oil pump shaft. Yes, you could remove the gear. Assemble everything. Drive the shaft as stated above. Disassemble and reinstall the gear and then go for fire up. I choose a different route. I removed the distributor, removed the spark plugs, removed the two plugs above and below the pressure relief port and then crank her over. But we'll wait a minute for the whole of the story. Lets do some fill in first.

Now to the first point of the original reason for this post. When pressure built up. It is shown coming from the top port above the pressure relief. So I connected my run stands oil pressure gauge to this port. But this also means that I am now utterly confused. If I connect the bypass filter as indicated by the stamped "outlet" port on the filter. The top port on the block will connect to the bottom port on the filter and of course the bottom port on the block will connect to the top port on the filter. But wait a minute. This would mean that we are driving oil up threw the center post of the canister, threw the restriction hole of the post, out and in to the center of the filter. It will pass through the filter media and out the upper hole of the canister to be returned to the block. That is not the direction of flow for a more modern filter. Ahhhhh! Hence I have bypassed the bypass filter for the initial run up and will avail to figure this out later.

The second part of the story and much shorter. Always check the box when you get parts in the mail. Guess what I found wrapped in bubble wrap at the bottom of the box I got the bypass filter in? I had thrown several items in to one box and hadn't noticed the weight. When I removed the other parts to put them on the shelf. The box was still to heavy to be empty. Yup, there is was. The stand off mount for the oil filter. Now I don't have to make one for my other HD.

To wrap this up. I reinstalled the distributor and set the timing about where I thought. Installed the now single bottom plug below the pressure relief. Reinstalled the plugs and double checked the firing order. Splashed a little fuel in the tank. OK, one more time around for visual checks. Clicked on the electric pusher fuel pump. Checked the manual fuel pumps sight glass for fuel. Switched on the coil power and pushed the start button. Bam! A roar to life and 22psi of oil pressure. I'll double check the manual and set this to standards.

Now on to machining a clutch alignment pin and installing the clutch and trans.
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