Different Fuels?


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Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:09 am

Different Fuels?

Hi,

Not really sure where to ask this, but perhaps someone here can tell me.

What is the practical difference between Diesel #1, Diesel #2, red or clear diesel, Kerosene, Home heating oil, winter and summer blends and what is interchangeable for use in home heaters and diesel trucks and other ag equipment? I've heard some people say they can run diesel in their home heaters instead of the much more expensive kerosene with no problem (despite what the fuel sellers say) and I've heard other people say it can't be done with diesel at all because it smells so bad.

Being from Southern Calif I have no practical experience with any fuel other than gasoline and natural gas, but the extremely high cost of heating fuel in Northern Calif is killing me. What is interchangeable?

Thank you for your comments.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:02 am

Re: Different Fuels?

1st diesel: the difference between red (ag) and clear, is that clear diesel has had the road tax collected at the point of retail sale. It is also limited to the amount of Sulphur allowed in the fuel. Dyed diesel hasn't had the tax collected and is illegal for use in vehicle on public roads. In practice most dyed diesel is also low Sulphur as it doesn't make much sense to make both kinds, and often the same undyed fuel is pumped out of the tank farm for both use, the fuel destined to be for non road use then gets dyed "at the rack" (at the tank farm) while the road fuel does not and tax has to be collected for that fuel.
1# vs. 2# diesel: Most diesel burned in the US is #2. It has a higher cloud and gel point than #1 and more BTU's per gal as well. Cloud point is the temperature when the paraffin in the fuel starts to solidify, which is when it will start to clog filters, gel point is the point that the fuel becomes gelatinous and will not pump. Sometimes this is referred to as pour point. #1 fuel has a much lower cloud and gel point and lower BTU per gal. It has less lube characteristics than does #2 and cost more. For this reason, #1 is not the fuel of choice down here, but is mixed with #2 in the winter to lower the cloud point. Up north it is burned straight, and even down in the US is available straight at pumps in the northern tier states for use in reefer units and for mixing in the main truck tanks. Reefers, with the tank under the trailer and the unit far away on the front of the trailer are prone to "gelling" where the fuel is clogging the filters because it never gets heated from the engine. Both #1 and #2 can be dyed (just means no tax) but most home heating oil is #2 dyed diesel.
Kero is the next grade "lighter" than # 1. It is highly refined and doesn't gel (it is the basis of jet fuel). Kero will work well in wick type heaters and lamps, where #1 or #2 will not. Most torpedo heater and home furnaces, will work fine on it, but it is the most expensive of the 3 fuels. Running #2 or #1 diesel in a torpedo heater will work, but the nozzle will need more frequent cleaning, the smaller the nozzle the more this applies. It is not recommended for motor fuel as it has little lube ability, but can be used to "cut" some #2 to lower the cloud point. It generally doesn't have road tax on it however, so using it in a motor vehicle would be illegal. I could be mixed for a generator or other stationary use. All torpedo type heaters exhaust some fumes, as long as it burning correctly, diesel shouldn't make more fumes than karo. My Espar heater in my truck can burn #2 thru karo with no adjustments, and dyed or un dyed fuel legally as it doesn't provide motion, only heat. I have burned diesel in a torpedo heater, and other than having to clean the nozzle more often it did fine. Home furnaces are designed to burn #2, so no problem there, you can even mix small amounts of waste engine oil into the tank (of a home furnace) and it will burn that too!

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:47 am

Re: Different Fuels?

Awesome explanation, CB.

Golden Jubilee
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Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:34 am

Re: Different Fuels?

I am not suggesting that others try what I have burned in a 6.9 Diesel engine I installed in an R120. The power changed very little between the bio - mixes and the other combination I tried.
I worked with a guy who had nearly 1000 litres of olive oil that was no longer suitable for food. I was given a significant amount to try as fuel. The 6.9 with a Stanadyne injection started and ran as usual. I tried linseed oil, ATF, kerosene, bio-mix and 40 W mixed 20% with Diesel. Just for the sake of adventure I tried adding 4 litres of WD40 that was about 10% of the fuel in the tank. I tried clean paint thinner with Diesel fuel. Canola, corn and peanut oils were tried and after 225,000 miles the engine was running just fine.
I am not suggesting that anyone try what I tried. The different fuels and combinations worked for me. Maybe I was just lucky. The exhaust did smell unusual sometimes.
My 2002 Cummins Dodge 2500 4X4 gets only seasonally adjusted Diesel fuel.
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Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:11 pm

Re: Different Fuels?

my sister in law in Ohio has what they call a grease car, a Mercedes they burn refuse oil from Chinese/fast food restaurants,

as long as they have the heat wrap on fuel lines it seems to works OK, makes you kind of hungry driving it,

on a side, when I worked in the orchards in the 70s we all used Coleman type stoves and lanterns, which used Coleman brand fuel at about $4.00 a gallon back then,

in 1975 there was the great Coleman fuel shortage, you couldn't buy a can of it if you could find one,

I talked to a old orchard hand, he said: "hell boy, that's just white gas, or unleaded, just go fill your Coleman can with unleaded which was about 60 cents a gallon,

so I decided to try it, filled my stove tank with unleaded, pumped it up, lit it and ran like hell, well it burned just fine,

pump unleaded isn't as pure as Coleman fuel I guess, but it seems to work fine,

so from then on I just ran unleaded in my stoves & lanterns, over 40 years without an explosion, of course Coleman highly suggests Not to do this, I don't even know what a can of Coleman fuel goes for now days, a lot more than pump gas I'd guess
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Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:52 pm

Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:24 pm

Re: Different Fuels?

BRJ, our first shop location was behind a Mexican restaurant. When the recycle truck showed up to pump the old cooking grease out of the holding tank we RAN.
I have never, ever smelled something so BAD and so LARGE. It was remarkable. Like a stinky volcano cloud you can't walk out of.
I can't imagine dainty people using this to power ANYTHING. :)
Sheesh! Yuck!

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Location: Lyman, IA

Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:35 pm

Re: Different Fuels?

I once ran out of gas in my B18 powered Volvo. All I had was Coleman fuel, it ran on it but didn't like it Knocked real bad, and ran about as good with the key off as it did on! (run on). I don't think coleman fuel is above 40 octane!
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Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 4922

Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:47 am

Location: Bothell, Washington

Post Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:13 pm

Re: Different Fuels?

I had a 60 something 122, my sis had a 544, then a P-18, Volvos will run forever, I bought a 74 Volvo with B18 motor from a lady, she did a 360 on a overpass with it, dented in every corner, her boyfriend hooked the hose up wrong and it was pressuring the crankcase, forcing oil out everywhere,

I paid next to nothing for it, rerouted the hoses and leak problem solved, it had one dead cylinder, Zero compression, I drove that car freeway speeds back and forth from WA. state to California and back numerous times and over mountain passes,

It ran forever, I finally traded it to a friend for a SD-220 motor to transplant into my KB-1
Gentle Men! you can't fight in here! This is the war room!

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