politic on the board


Just keep it clean please....

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Thu Aug 08, 2019 5:37 pm

Re: politic on the board

In Canada, any person wanting to purchase and own a gun must pass a test called the FAC. Firearms Acquisition Certificate. The applicant may be required to take a gun handling, storage and safety course.
Mental illness and a criminal history will disqualify a person. Illegal guns are still available from the black market.
I do not know how a Country like USA will ever get control and change the gun ownership laws. First there has to be a majority of the public wanting to have changes made. Gun laws in Canada and Australia changed and in both countries there was resistance.
I am not a gun owner, but I have an appreciation for well made tools. I did not like to see fine rifles and hand guns run through a chipper.
I cannot be convinced that stricter gun control would have made any difference in the recent troubles. If a person is bent on shooting up any place or persons, they will find the weapons they need.
Canada is not without our share of crackers. A Canada wide search for two shooters just ended in Manitoba. The bodies of the suspects were found in the woods. Sadly three persons lost their lives at the hands of someone. One was American, one Australian and one a Canadian.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have

Golden Jubilee
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Post Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:48 pm

Re: politic on the board

randemon wrote:Not to turn this into a forum for/against gun control, but don't believe everything you see in the news. Granted, we do have a problem, but it's not nearly as bad as the news would make you think. The news has overblown the whole situation, resulting in a panic that is well beyond the risk. The number of people killed with guns yearly in the US is typically less than the number that die in vehicle accidents, yet how many people have a fear of cars? How often does a major freeway accident end up repeated in the news for days and weeks afterwards? And according to a recent article in Discover magazine, roughly half the gun fatalities are from suicide, not attacks from nuts, thieves, or disgruntled neighbors. While certainly tragic, the chances of a random person being killed by a firearm is not that high, and no where near as high as the hype in the news would make you think.

While I will agree with your point about the number of deaths from motor vehicles, it should be noted however that a guns purpose is to kill, either hunting or self defense, it is of little use for some other purpose.
Vehicles use is for transportation, and like any tool if used in a careless manor can cause death, but that is not its prime purpose. Millions and millions use motor vehicles every day for many hours safely, the shear number in use is going to lead to mishaps. guns are not used in that volume or daily in those numbers. If you took every time a gun was fired and put it next to every minute a vehicle was driven, and then compared the number of deaths that resulted, the gun would be the greater killer.
Motor vehicles have more oversite and regulations then guns, Does it stop people from drinking and driving, no, does it stop people from operating without a lic or insurance, not always, but it does bring consequences. A car can be stopped and checked for registration and insurance, and the driver checked for a lic. A valid tag must be displayed
Un licensed (black market) gun exist in every country, but the US has biggest problem by far of any developed nation. Part is due to the Myth of this nations birth, that local residents with guns defeated an army. while part of that may be true, with the change of warfare over the years the same would not hold true today.

Golden Jubilee
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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:33 am

Re: politic on the board

I think it will take some time but as these mass murders happen more and more even beyond what is now unacceptable enough american lives will be directly effected by this whether victims or families of those victims that there will be a ground swell of people calling out for a change in the guns laws that even the NRA will not be able to stem. If responsible gun owners are smart they will get on the bandwagon now for sensible gun laws before they lose the rights to own guns altogether.

My comment on the well armed militia fallacy is just that, it is a fallacy. Any armed insurrection in this country based on whatever principle would be squashed like a bug by the military in about a week (see current US military budget), mopping up the strays may take a week or two longer although if people want to keep a brown Bess black powder musket at home in their closet I'm all for that just in case the Iroquois or Seneca start raiding our frontier outposts again, .
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Yard Art
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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:23 pm

Re: politic on the board

Just a couple of more comments and then I'm out of here. This could easily go on forever without any agreement.

Those pushing for more gun control here refuse to acknowledge that guns can also save lives. Over a decade ago the FBI commissioned a study that estimated that guns were used in self defense as many as 2 million times a year here. Note that in the vast majority of these cases, the gun was never fired. Just showing it was enough to make the bad guys give up or run away. How many rapes, murders, kidnappings and so on were prevented? We'll never know because there is no good way to track things that didn't happen. And you almost never hear about this in the news.

Most of the mass shootings here (approx 90%) occur in so called "gun free zones" where the law abiding population is disarmed, giving the bad guys free reign to kill and terrorize until the police arrive. In cases where there are armed citizens present, the bad guys were stopped sooner, saving many of the potential victims.

We have a violence problem here. It's not just about guns. In the recent news someone went on a rampage, killing four and injuring more. The weapon? A knife. At other times, multiple killings were done with gasoline, and others by running over people with a truck. If some nut wants to kill, there are many ways to do it. And again, these cases don't get near as much news coverage as a mass shooting.

And finally, we can't stop the smuggling of tons of illegal drugs into this country, so why does anyone think we can keep the bad guys from getting guns? If all guns were banned tomorrow, the bad guys would still have them.

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:52 pm

Re: politic on the board

Binder Mike wrote:I think it will take some time but as these mass murders happen more and more even beyond what is now unacceptable enough american lives will be directly effected by this whether victims or families of those victims that there will be a ground swell of people calling out for a change in the guns laws that even the NRA will not be able to stem. If responsible gun owners are smart they will get on the bandwagon now for sensible gun laws before they lose the rights to own guns altogether.

My comment on the well armed militia fallacy is just that, it is a fallacy. Any armed insurrection in this country based on whatever principle would be squashed like a bug by the military in about a week (see current US military budget), mopping up the strays may take a week or two longer although if people want to keep a brown Bess black powder musket at home in their closet I'm all for that just in case the Iroquois or Seneca start raiding our frontier outposts again, .


This is a question for more than just the person whom I "quoted". : Have you served in the military?

On some things we may never agree, just as with some others, we may never agree. However, do not let it stop a discussion. The issues this country face are on a multitude of levels and will take a multitude of solutions. The "Gun" issue has so many laws, will more really fix it? I believe the answer to that is NO.
You might be surprised at how many in the Military take the "Oath" very serious. I stay on quite a few military bases, and I do talk to many of the military folks on those bases. They know most of those who will fire on Americans and they will protect Americans from being fired upon. If the "might" of the American Military is ever turned on upon the general population, this country as we have known it will cease to exist. I do not believe it will ever happen. As long as the "discussions" here remain civil, this thread will stay.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:31 pm

Re: politic on the board

I would like to think 100% of those taking the oath are serious. I would be surprised at less than 100 percent.
The countries we live in are changed and continue to change. Apathy and low voter turnout make it easier for corrupt politicians to get elected and get funded by special interests groups.
Democracy cannot exist without a strong media. Demonizing the media by labeling them as fake news is a threat to democracy. We are fortunate, here in Canada, to have independent media. Our media is often referred to as the unofficial opposition.
I hope it is not too late for a fix.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have

Site Admin
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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:48 pm

Re: politic on the board

No, Nikki, there are some who are "political" in the Military and Yes, I firmly believe that they do NOT take their oath as serious. I will agree that voter apathy is harmful to any country. As for the Media, When the Media continues to push false stories, they are "fake". When they ONLY print what supports one side of an issue, they are "fake". Having a good and fair media is important. And yes, for those who will say, but, but FOX! Did I not say that when a news organization ONLY prints/reports one side, they are Fake! I read "news" from many different sources, both Left and Right and those that consider themselves "unbiased", I do my best to glean the truth out of all of it. Yes, the world is changing, and I fear, not for the best(this can be a subjective belief).

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:56 pm

Re: politic on the board

Any conscious person with any interest in what goes on around them could do well by reading some H.L. Mencken.
https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/h_l_mencken_490503
Henry Louis Mencken (September 12, 1880 – January 29, 1956) was an American journalist, essayist, satirist, cultural critic and scholar of American English.
H.L.Mencken was both respected and feared. He lived at a time in our history when persons knew the difference between irony and coincidence, the difference between a cap and a hat and contractions had not become misused and condemned communication to suffer the insult out of context.
In the interest of keeping this discussion civil, it is be important to keep personal experiences out of the discussion.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:45 pm

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:18 pm

Re: politic on the board

One of my favorite authors is Barbara Ehrenreich. She said, “Why believe when you can know? She goes on to suggest, "Belief in something cuts off intellectual curiosity and the search for truth." When a person takes on belief, the conversation is over. This is an area where a person takes shelter and any discussion of belief becomes and attack on the person.
I would rather have tools I do not need than to need tools I do not have

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

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Post Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:00 pm

Re: politic on the board

This is a question for more than just the person whom I "quoted". : Have you served in the military?

As long as the "discussions" here remain civil, this thread will stay.[/quote]

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I have been shot at enough and had enough bullets wiz over my head for one lifetime.

I will always remain respectful of the members here regardless of their views but my observations and comments may have some irony or a bit of an edge to them, it's just who I am, I wish no one ill will.
Last edited by Binder Mike on Sat Aug 10, 2019 3:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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