Old fire truck


The workhorse

Rusty Driver
Rusty Driver

Posts: 176

Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2017 8:50 pm

Location: Below the pinky finger of the Mitten

Post Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:22 pm

Re: Old fire truck

You would do well to heed the advice of the gentlemen posting in this thread. Well, not me, but those other guys really know their stuff.

Freshly Restored
Freshly Restored

Posts: 279

Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:50 am

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 5:56 pm

Re: Old fire truck

Hello Sir,
I'm only a shade-tree self-taught mechanic, and I'm not an axle expert, but thought I'd throw my 2 cents in just in case it helps any. I bought the exact same axle, an S-9000, to convert my Loadstar 1700 to 4wd. There is some info about it at the end of this thread: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=9172
The IH axle code for the S-9000 is either a FA64 or FA78. I have not found any difference in the IH parts manuals between these two.
Per the IH parts manuals, there were several ratios available. And most of those ring and pinions have the same part numbers as used in a rear RA30 axle so that tells me the RA30 carrier assembly was used in these S-9000 axles. But here is the actual list of R&P ratios listed for this front axle:

IH Part Number: R&P Ratio: R&P Number of teeth:
P/N: 69-021-R93 .... Ratio: 5.29 ... Teeth: 37-7
P/N: 578-793-C91 .. Ratio: 5.38 ... Teeth: 43-8
P/N: 69-022-R93 .... Ratio: 6.17 ... Teeth: 37-6
P/N: 69-014-R93 .... Ratio: 6.67 ... Teeth: 40-6
P/N: 69-015-R93 .... Ratio: 7.17 ... Teeth: 43-6

The above ratios are listed for the FA64 axles and FA78 axles and RA30 axles. In addition the P/N 1653808C91 for ratio 4.78 is listed for the RA30.
Weller axle remanufacturing in their catalog last revised in 2011 lists the following ratios as available: 5.29, 5.38, 6.17, 6.67, and 7.17. However I've found Weller to be very expensive. I wanted to buy a transmission gear from them and they wanted $1,000.00 for the trans gear. So it's anyone's guess what they might want for a R&P gear set. There is another supplier, New-Star, that sells replacement ring gear and pinion sets. Their latest catalog update (which has no date) lists 3 ratios available: 5.38, 6.17, and 7.17.

Your rear axle is different than mine so I can't tell you anything about it. But if I knew your IH axle code, I could probably look up in the parts book for information like I did for your front axle. And speaking of axle codes, I don't know if anyone has mentioned the Wisconsin Historical Society to you ... for a few dollars and your vehicle's vin number, they will send you a print-out of all the components and options your particular truck came with from the factory - including axle codes, axle ratios, engine, transmission, brakes, etc. etc.

As far as wheels go, I wanted to put some Michelin XZL's on my truck, one at each corner. It's a 46 in tall radial tire that costs $1200 to $1400.00 each new but can be had for $200 to $400 each from military surplus suppliers. Even when unused, the military must throw them away once they are 4 years old. I've just heard so many good things about this tire. And there is a company that will make rims for this 20 inch tire to fit our Dayton spoke hubs. Unfortunately I don't recall the name of that company, but I'm sure I could find it again with google searches.

Unlike most people on this site, I'm no truck mechanical expert and have little actual experience, but just wanted to give you a few more possibilities to think about.

I was just wondering, do you know if your truck came from the factory as 4wd? The bottom axle U-bolt plate looks home made and does not look at all like the factory-made U-bolt plate. Also I thought, although I could be mistaken, that the S-9000 axle was made for the S-Series of IH trucks.
Would sure like to see more pics of your truck. Once mechanically restored, I think you will find this to be a very capable, off and on-road dependable truck. I would not hesitate to take it anywhere wilderness camping. I look forward to when my truck is finished and I can take it 4x4 camping.

I'd like to ask a favor, could you please take some pictures of your spring hangers and steering box pitman arm and drag link? I've never actually seen one of these axles mounted to a Loadstar 1700. And if you install a diesel, would you want to sell your engine? I'm looking for a complete, good-running gas 345 V8.

Thank you

Freshly Restored
Freshly Restored

Posts: 279

Joined: Wed May 29, 2013 6:50 am

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:11 pm

Re: Old fire truck

hi,
Just thought I'd add a couple more points to my post above. It's called a Line Set Ticket or Line Setting Ticket is what you would want to request from the Wisconsin Historical Society for your truck.

Also, if you ever need parts for your front axle, go directly to a Dana dealer. Most parts are still available - but a seal that might cost $30 from Dana will cost $90 from Navistar. Most parts (except ring and pinion gear sets) are available for your front axle from both Dana and Navistar. But Navistar basically charges three times the price you would pay getting the part from a Dana dealer.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 4595

Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:28 pm

Location: Lyman, IA

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:27 pm

Re: Old fire truck

I was trying to remember where we went through all this before. When I saw the front drop out it looked similar to both Clark and the RA 30. When I saw the RA 30 I remembered we went down this path before.
The rear drop out looks similar to the rear- rear of a tandem RA472. The casting number or pinion number would clinch it.
If I am not mistaken, the RA472 housing is the same bolt pattern as Eaton uses, but unlike the Eaton housing, it is not notched for a 2 speed.
The reason I thought it may be a Clark is they make a center section that can be set up to revolve in either rotation. They make right and left ring gears.

Pile of Parts
Pile of Parts

Posts: 39

Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:49 pm

Location: Idaho

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:20 pm

Re: Old fire truck

Hi Steve, wow thank you so much for taking the time to post all that excellent information. Like you, I am not a real mechanic either but I find it necessary more and more to make this dream happen. This place has been like having a buddy that wants to help with guys like Cornbinder and you giving info freely!
Thanks for the compliments on my truck. I'd be happy to take pictures or measurements of whatever you need. The truck is at the shop as we speak. I'll get you some pictures as soon as it returns. The engine sold last week sorry. I do have a good 392 that I'd part with and can PM you with those details. I have another loadstar that is a parts truck so there is other parts too.

Pile of Parts
Pile of Parts

Posts: 39

Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:49 pm

Location: Idaho

Post Mon Feb 03, 2020 10:20 pm

Re: Old fire truck

Steve, I'm not sure weather this was a factory 4x4. I have read that all the loadstar 4X4's we're conversions by someone other than IH. Maybe Cornbinder can speak to that. The install on my truck is definitely not homemade. Also I have looked into the tires that you mentioned. I think I'm going to run caps from tirerecappers. I know that some have concerns running caps but I have weighed this decision and fell that for my application they will be safe.

Golden Jubilee
Golden Jubilee

Posts: 4595

Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:28 pm

Location: Lyman, IA

Post Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:48 am

Re: Old fire truck

This was posted over on JOT and would have been a help, Lists axle codes and who made the axle.
Attachments
Front axle.jpg

Rookie
Rookie

Posts: 10

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:47 am

Location: Post Falls ID

Post Fri Jun 19, 2020 9:55 pm

Re: Old fire truck

To the OP your fire truck is probably factory 4x4. I've owned a couple 77/78 crewcab 4x4s that were ex Forest Service engines. I currently own a 1700 regular cab 4x4 that is an old WA state DOT truck and it is factory 4x4. I know because I work at an International dealer and got a list of available parts for it from the parts department, lot of parts are obsolete and no longer available from the factory. Where in ID are you? I'm up in Post Falls and have a few old Loadstars in my yard.

Pile of Parts
Pile of Parts

Posts: 39

Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:49 pm

Location: Idaho

Post Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:16 am

Re: Old fire truck

Shortbus, I'm north of Boise about 45 minutes. My truck is solid and good to go shouldn't need any parts as far as running gear is concerned. I have a DT466 that will be going in maited to the Spicer 7 speed overdrive eso667b transmission. I want to keep the butterfly hood but I am afraid that I'm going to need to swap out to the fiberglass nose clip. If you have one of those and a doghouse I would be interested.
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